episode 35 with heidi rose robbins
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (00:00)
The first question I have for you today is one that I've started opening the podcast with. The question is, what does being in your body mean to you?
Heidi (00:08)
Mmm, such a good question. It means feeling radiant and regulated and integrated and easeful and playful and with the ability to fully receive.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (00:23)
I love that you included playful in your answer because it's something so important to me. For the listener who is new to the realm of astrology, using your 25 years and your knowledge of learning your ABCs along with your zodiac signs, which I just adore, I think it's so sweet, could you just give a basic premise of how, of what is astrology and how it can be really useful for our lives?
Heidi (00:38)
Mm-hmm.
Big question, but I will keep it simple. know, astrology is the study of the planets and the stars and how, as above, so below, how these great planetary beings are reflected within us. And for as long as humanity has been walking this planet, we have been looking to the stars and all over the world at different times.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (00:51)
I know.
Heidi (01:15)
the study, the gazing at the heavens began to be interpreted in different ways. And so for thousands of years, we have been looking to the heavens for when do we move, when do we plant? And then in the last several hundred years, we started to look at it in terms of what does it mean that we were born at this very specific moment, this tiny little snapshot? What does it mean for each of us on our path?
And we have been growing this way of looking at ourselves and our path and even, you know, countries have astrological charts and businesses have astrological charts. So we've been growing this way of interpreting this moment of birth. astrology is bottom line. It's a beautiful tool and lens to
used to look at our own gifts and challenges and hopefully grow in consciousness and light and love throughout our lifetimes as a result of using this tool.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (02:18)
I loved your answer, and since
you've been spent decades guiding people, clients all over the world, what do you think people often are searching for when they turn to astrology?
Heidi (02:28)
Hmm.
They're looking for a loving mirror and a loving map and they're looking for encouragement around their capacity to give their gift in the world. And it's such a, I mean, honestly, this is one of the biggest reasons that I love astrology because it's a tool of encouragement and it's a tool of love and it's a tool of upliftment and
That's all we need. That's all we need. That's all most of us need is to be seen with eyes of love and then to also be honestly spoken to about how to cultivate the gifts inherent in this gorgeous moment that you came into the world.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (03:12)
I loved that in your answer that you actually used a very poetic languaging and I'm curious to hear if it is intentional that you combine astrology and poetics or poetry or if that's just something essential to you.
Heidi (03:29)
Well, I think both. think both. I think I have always loved both of these things. And only recently, I would say, in the last number of years have I said, huh, they actually have a lot of similarity. You know, I wrote a poem once called You Are a Poem, but it's all about astrology, right? So that you are this gorgeous poem of planets dancing and stars shining, right?
And so poetry for me cuts into the mystery. Like if you have a beautiful poem read to you.
your world can open. And if you have a wonderful chart reading, your world can open to this greater mystery. Because you know, when you look at a poem, most of it is like blank space all around it, right? There's this little poem. So what wasn't said, what is yet to be said, what does saying something so simply and beautifully open for each of us? And I think it's the same in a chart reading. So.
I'm a lucky person that I get to call myself an astrologer and a poet. it's, you know, it's, I feel I consider that there's a lot of grace working in my life that I get to work with both of these things.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (04:38)
question that I have for you is around how astrology is oftentimes seen as quite esoteric or intellectual and yet the way that you bring it forward in the world is quite artistic. It uses this poetic language. It kind of merges these two things together and that really makes me think of the role of the body and the body as a portal or the body as a creative expression and I'm curious for you to hear if there is a link between astrology or embodiment.
that has been maybe quite present in your mind or maybe it has just been quite an embodied experience if you do see a link between those two things.
Heidi (05:14)
10,000%. I went to school for acting and I almost immediately though when I got out of school, I started to direct and I started to help people put on their own one person shows and I, and so always for the first, let's just say 25 years of my life, I was
training in the body. was training in embodiment, right? I mean, I was learning to move and I was learning to inhabit a character. And so, and I was learning about presence and I was learning about confidence and I was learning about light and radiance, right? At the same time, I grew up with a very brilliant father who was an astrologer, who was very mental, like hyper, hyper, like I couldn't understand.
80 % of what he said. I mean, that's not entirely true, but he was brilliant and he saw the world from a cosmological big perspective. But I knew that I was never going to be able to engage with astrology in quite that way. And I knew that if I was going to engage with astrology, it had to be through the body. So yes, I do one-on-one readings, but a huge part of what I do is working in retreats with, actually for the most part, it's been women.
but to inhabit our charts. And so we're up and we're inhabiting Venus and we're inhabiting what it feels like to have the moon in Capricorn. And by embodying that, we are setting ourselves free and we're finding the obstructions or the places that we feel closed in our bodies. And in so doing, we're allowing a new energy in so that we can use our charts in new ways.
Yeah? So if you amplify something like, let's just say, you know, let's just say I have the moon in Capricorn. That's true. So if I'm, and this is not the only way we do it, but if in this moment I'm going to say to you, I'm going to show you the hardest part of being the moon in Capricorn. I might get up in front of you and just freeze and be as controlled as I possibly can and be sort of mute and be kind of trying to control things.
And I might amplify that and amplify that and amplify that until I finally go, my God, this is so uncomfortable. What's my other choice here? And I can let it go and see if there are other ways that I can work with this energy, teach myself to work with this energy. So the short answer is that's all I've done, Ailey, in my life is try to combine embodiment and astrology. That's one of the huge things that I've done.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (07:41)
What have been some of the challenges in making that combination? Because my first real introduction to astrology was actually when I went to the Youngeen Institute in Zurich for a summer and I loved it. I was like, okay, I can actually, I'm understanding it, I'm grasping it, but that institute, LASA is amazing, it's like so deeply disembodied. It's so heady. So I would love to hear from you how you've been able to do that because you've done something that has made astrology
so accessible to so many people.
Heidi (08:14)
Well, you know, it's like looking back through your life and saying, well, why was I interested in theater to begin with? And I honestly think I was interested in it because I wanted to learn about full self-expression, you know, and I wanted to learn about full authenticity and owning oneself and sharing oneself fully. you know, I was attracted to acting, but I was really attracted to full...
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (08:19)
Mmm.
Heidi (08:42)
full self-expression. And so when I got to this point where I was learning astrology, because I think I, you know, very early on I said, wow, this is a cool language and look at, know, dad would point out various friends and boyfriends and would be like, well, this is his chart and this is her chart. And so I was immediately taken with the language, but I very quickly realized there was no way that I just wanted to sit and teach it from a neck up perspective.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (08:56)
You
Heidi (09:07)
because I could see the relief when maybe it started with me just embodying, you maybe it started with me just going, well, Leo or Capricorn and people seeing people come alive because people want to feel vital and alive and engaged. So maybe when I first started teaching, you know, I was, I was recognizing that my own embodiment was setting something free in them. And then
It's just been this huge process of experimentation. And I've been blessed to work with a team of women that are just unbelievable actors and embodiers and teachers themselves. And so we've just developed over many years, all different kinds of, you know, exercises and experiences that we now know work and people feel.
better and people feel like they know themselves and people feel like they can express their fuller selves now.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (10:00)
On that place of self-expression, I'm curious to hear from you if there are some particular signs or moon rising or anything of that like that actually leads someone to have a deeper sense of the body. If there's ways that we can kind of play with the chart to actually create more vitality inside ourselves and create that deeper connection.
Heidi (10:17)
Yeah.
That's great question. Look, I think there are signs that lend themselves to that, and then there are signs where you have to work a little harder. But it doesn't mean that all the signs can be embodied for sure. And you probably know this, but you know, every sign is connected to a part of the body, and is also connected to maybe systems in the body. So for example, Taurus is connected to the throat or the neck.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (10:28)
Mm-hmm.
Heidi (10:48)
So if people are speaking or singing with Taurus Rising, that's gonna help them feel embodied, right? So isn't that, yeah.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (10:55)
Can I pause you, Heidi? I
wanna hear where the zodiac signs are connected to the body, cause I don't know. Let's go.
Heidi (11:00)
Yeah. Yes. good, good, good. Okay. So I'm to be
very simple about it. I'm going to say Aries is connected to the whole head and really the forehead, the whole head. Taurus is connected to the throat and the neck. Gemini is connected to the hands and the lungs. Okay. That's very interesting. Gemini people often need to learn to breathe because they breathe very superficially sometimes. Okay.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (11:08)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Heidi (11:24)
Cancer
is connected to the breasts and the stomach. Leo is connected to the heart and sometimes the spine. Virgo is connected to the intestines because Virgos are always digesting experience and saying, I can use this, but I can't use this or I'm going to clean this out, know, so it's connected to the intestines. Libra is connected to the kidneys. And there's much more than this, but I'm just giving you the highlights. Libra is connected to the kidneys.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (11:27)
Hmm.
Heidi (11:50)
Scorpio is connected to the reproductive system and all the eliminative systems as well. Sagittarius is connected to the legs and the thighs, know, skiers and jumpers and basketball players and all of that. Capricorn is connected to the skeleton and the knees. mean, specifically the knees, but the entire skeleton. Aquarius is connected to the ankles because it's something about the flexibility of the whole, you know, the whole body. And Pisces beautifully is connected to the feet. And if you think of like,
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (12:17)
Hmm.
Heidi (12:17)
Pisces is a sign that's connected to saints and bodhisattvas. And if you think about the feet and the blessing that the feet leave, you know, as you walk the path. so that's simple. That's a simple chart through, but it's so much fun and so interesting when you think about embodying. Sometimes I say, well, what's my sun, and rising? Okay. My sun, moon and rising Aries, Leo, Capricorn. So head, heart, knees or head, heart, skeleton.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (12:42)
Hmm.
Heidi (12:43)
And it's just an interesting way to think about how can I bring those alive? And if I bring those parts alive, is there something happening that is making me feel more embodied?
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (12:55)
I would love to know how the link between those signs, you did start to name some of them, where the signs and the parts of the bodies came from. If there's like a specific place where that comes from or in astrology or if it's more felt and has developed through embodiment.
Heidi (13:10)
I wish I knew the first person that connected it, but there's this great book that Tashen published, T-A-S-C-H-E-N, you know, that wonderful publisher, and they have this beautiful section at the beginning of about just 10 pages of the history of astrology that is bullet pointed, that's the most beautiful kind of simple unfolding, and then it's a book full of images of the charts. But from certainly,
early, early on, the body started to be connected. I would say like, for sure, the medieval times, it started to be connected then. And you see these old drawings, you know, of the body and the signs in the Renaissance too. And so, you know, somewhere in there, for sure, because you start to see the paintings and such.
But it's an excellent question that I don't actually have the answer to. So often with astrology, we don't know where a specific connection was made. But I will say this, Aries has always been connected to the ram, right? And the ram is known for its horns that bash. So it makes sense that the head would be connected. Taurus is connected to the bull. The bull, think about the neck of a bull.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (14:04)
Hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Heidi (14:24)
Right? So you can start to go in that direction as well. And you can sort of wonder if it was like the constellation or the animal connected then brought the body part. I don't know.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (14:31)
Hmm.
I love the imagery that you're bringing in. I'll bring us back to the question I had asked, because I am genuinely quite curious to hear what zodiac signs maybe lend themselves closer to an embodied state and which ones are maybe naturally a little bit more disembodied and it's a little bit more challenging to be in the body.
Heidi (14:45)
Yes, yes
Okay, so I'm going to just say that obviously the air signs are trickier because Gemini, Libra, and Aquarius at a very simple level are all about the mind and and they're brilliant and they're quick quick thinking and moving and they're all about this mental exchange so you could make the case that that's going to be those are going to be some of the trickiest signs right?
You could also say that fire signs, mean, fire signs can be quite physical. So there's athleticism with like Aries, Sagittarius, and Leo, but they're also burn really bright and fast. And they can also have a mental energy connected. They're more air and fire, more outward going yang kind of energies. Whereas Taurus Virgo Capricorn, the earth signs,
and Cancer, Scorpio, Pisces, the water signs, these are considered the more internal or divine feminine, or I would say to you embodied, naturally embodied energies because they're connected to the divine feminine and the divine feminine is all about the body, right? So if I were gonna be very simplistic about it, I would divide it sort of half and half in that way.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (16:09)
How can we use our chart to create a greater connection to our body now that we've kind of laid some of the foundation down?
Heidi (16:16)
Mm-hmm.
This is actually a beautiful question. So I would just, I would start by saying this.
our rising sign and many people still don't know their rising sign though it's getting better. What's your rising sign? Do you know? Okay, beautiful. Virgo is so, actually Virgo is so deeply connected to the devotion of the body and connected to the practices that help us take care of our vessel and our vehicle, right? So we start by looking at the rising sign and we say to ourselves, this position,
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (16:28)
Mine is Virgo.
Heidi (16:48)
is the position that would give us the most soul satisfaction. This position is the position that we can generously give of ourselves. So how can we use this particular energy to take care of and live into this beautiful vessel that we have? So, you know, a Virgo rising person would say, my goodness, I know that in order to feel soul satisfied,
I have to have certain spiritual practices, even if that means I sit down and light a candle, or even if that means I do a yoga practice in the morning. We know that even mundane things for a Virgo have to have a sacred significance. And that's gonna put you at ease in your body. That's gonna bring you sweetness and presence in your body.
Like I was saying, maybe Taurus rising. If I know that I'm a Taurus rising and Taurus is about beauty and it's about intuition and it's about being grounded and it's about stillness, I might practice moving very slowly or spending great amounts of time being still in meditation or singing because of the throat. know, all of these things bring me more deeply into the body.
So I guess I would start with the rising sign as, but there, could go through every planet and I could talk with you about the planet and position connected to the body. I'll say one more thing. The moon in the chart is very connected to the body. The moon is embodiment and the body. And so if we feel stuck or frozen or anxious in the body in some way,
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (18:08)
Hmm.
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Heidi (18:33)
Usually the sign opposite the moon is an antidote for that blockage or feelings of being uncomfortable or feelings of being disembodied. Usually the sign opposite is a great help.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (18:48)
You're making me think of my chart right now, but I'll redirect myself. I would love to hear.
Heidi (18:52)
But it's a good example though. should tell,
maybe just out of curiosity, this is a good example. Like what is your moon?
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (18:59)
My moon is Pisces, but then across from it is Leo. So you're just making me... it's Virgo. Okay then, thank you.
Heidi (19:05)
actually across from Pisces is Virgo. It's Virgo.
no, you're, so which is even more perfect because that means that the Pisces dreaminess and Pisces can sometimes leave its body through the dream through imagination, right? It be, gets so like, it's so beautiful, but it can be sort of gone from its body in a way, you know, or Pisces can say, the things, the body are so heavy. I just want to
I want to drift and dream and float and be connected to God. So in your case, the antidote is once again, Virgo, your rising sign. So Virgo is really important for you because both are pointed in that direction.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (19:37)
Mm-hmm.
You're the first person who's been able to like really sink in my vergoness on my chart. I've had other people explain it to me before and I've been like, I don't really know how that resonates, but as you're describing it, it deeply does. And I would love to hear from you because you also just kind of sprinkled it in your answer. When we look at the planets that we're in right now and the movement that we're in right now from an astrology sense, what does that give us information about in regards to?
our embodiment both individually but also collectively.
Heidi (20:15)
Yeah. Well, okay. So if you're going to look at your chart, you'll see the wheel, you'll see the 12 houses, you know, we all have a birth chart. But then if I'm going to look with you at what's going on in the heavens right now, you'll look at a chart that has your birth chart at the center, but then all around it are where the planets are moving right now. And that's where it gets so interesting because that's where your opportunity lies. So
So in other words, let's just choose a planet and connect it to embodiment. Saturn takes 29 years to go around the chart. It moves quite slowly, right? So if I divide it up, that means it spends two and a half years in every sign. So right now, Saturn is getting ready to move into the sign of Aries. It's been in Pisces, which
should have been an interesting time for you. It's been in Pisces for about two plus years. And now it will be moving into Aries. And Aries, when Saturn moves into a sign, what happens is it says, you must pay attention here. You must be disciplined here. You must show up for yourself here. You must practice here. And so you can connect that
to the body, you know, like you might be Saturn might show up on your son, it might line up with your son, like for anybody who has an airy son, Saturn is going to line up on their son. And it might be a time where I say, okay, I'm going to have less energy than usual, because Saturn is demanding, or I'm going to need to stand upright and be enough be like, feel my skeleton upright. That's very Saturn.
or I'm going to have to be enormously patient with this body and being. So you can take any planet and you can see where it's lighting up your chart and it can give you some indications about whether you want to be expansive in your embodiment or your movement, whether you want to be more careful, whether you want to be more still, whether you want to be more full of movement, you know, each planet can give you little hints.
Does that, is that helpful? Does that make sense for you? Okay. Okay.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (22:28)
It does make sense, yes it does. With
what we are collectively in right now and we look to things like the moon or kind of the system that we're in, is there any information that's available to us kind of all about the time that we're in in this very moment in regards to our ability to be connected to self or maybe disconnected?
Heidi (22:48)
Yeah, this is a huge moment for us astrologically. It's because five major planets, outer planets are shifting into new signs this year. So it's a seismic shift. So I'm going to choose one, okay? There's a lot of movement, but I'm going to choose one that will help us be more embodied, okay? So this summer,
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (23:06)
Yeah.
Heidi (23:12)
Jupiter, the planet of yes, the planet of expansion, the planet of optimism, moves into the sign of cancer. Now, there's a beautiful phrase for cancer. It says, I build a lighted house and therein dwell. And guess what the lighted house is? The lighted house is our body and our home and our family and our country.
Okay. So we are starting this summer going to have more help, Jupiter, building our house of light, whether it's our own little internal space that feels really depressed right now and really stuck and really like, what the hell is going on? We get to fill that with more light starting this summer. And there are other things before that, of course, but so, and we get to feel safe.
That's a cancer thing. know, when, you have cancer working well in the chart, it's like a feeling of safety in your body, in your home. So that's one of the shifts that's a happy shift that is happening that is going to absolutely help us feel more emotionally calm.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (24:23)
Can you share the other four, if we have time and space or maybe in a succinct way? Because I'm also curious about the other shifts that might be happening that also might make us feel disconnected or some that are maybe don't have a net effect on our sense of embodiment, but are important for us to be aware of.
Heidi (24:41)
Yeah. Okay, so we all know, I think, if we've been at all tuned into astrology, that Pluto moved into Aquarius. That happened, it started last year and is now officially there. So Pluto in Aquarius is seismic because it's already spent, it's spent 20 years in Capricorn.
And now it's going to spend 15 to 20 years in Aquarius. And so it's very slow moving. And Pluto in Aquarius has everything to do with what we're going through, is like in the United States is our democracy, across the world, really, is our democracy going to stand? There's a huge death to old forms like patriarchy and.
Capitalism, like there's things are crumbling, right? And this is Pluto and Aquarius and we're having to learn to work together in a new way and we're having to share in a new way and we're still far from that but this is the opportunity over the next 20 years. So this is a seismic shift. Another seismic shift is that the planet Neptune, which is the planet of the dream, the planet of love, the planet of sensitivity is moving into Aries and at the end of this month, by the way,
And it has been in Pisces for 13 years, 13, 14 years. So this is very interesting, I think, when it comes to the body, because Neptune in Pisces is kind of like, how can I escape? Like Neptune in Pisces really does want to like not be in this tangible experience. It really does want to feel the connection with bliss, the connection with God. It's very, it's a beautiful combination. It's very imaginative and
but it's gonna move into Aries. So to me that says, you have to come forth with your imagination, your artistry, your sensitivity. You have to lead with your imagination, your artistry, your sensitivity. The last time it was there was during the Civil War. And I have to say a person that I think about during the Civil War that did that was Harriet Tubman, you know, and the Underground, the railroad. She came forth with this power to save.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (26:33)
Mm-hmm.
Heidi (26:41)
And we need that right now. And I think that also, the fire helps Neptune be more embodied. And,
Saturn also moves into Aries this year at the end of May, which will commit us to new beginnings and new initiatives and leadership. That's that combo is really important. And one that might be trickier in terms of embodiment is that Uranus will move into Gemini also this summer. That only that's been seven to eight years in a sign.
So urinus in Gemini tends to be very mental. It tends to be very mental and it's like zing, zing, zing, zing, zing, zing, zing. And so we're going to have to counteract that because there's some instability in that. It certainly speeds up the information that's exchanged, but we're going to need to like, like use some of the Jupiter in cancer to be like, you are not, you cannot bring that phone in this room. Right? Like how do you.
And you, my friend, are like priestess, like Virgo rising and the moon and Pisces. This is the priestess energy that says we need to have certain practices in place that actually allow us to feel at peace and allow us to let love pour through and allow us to be connected to something greater than ourselves that has nothing to do with technology, that has nothing to do with
the speed of thought. has everything to do with how we're connected in love.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (28:13)
Thank you, that's what my book is about upcoming, but Heidi doesn't know that, so we'll get into that later. I would love to hear from you, because you just did, again, another beautiful embodiment. It's touching back on something that I just briefly touched on at the start, was poetry and astrology. And if you maybe see poetry as an embodiment practice for you, if you feel like you kind of tap into this place in your body, because you said both like...
Heidi (28:18)
my god.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (28:37)
poetry and astrology chart, it's the same similar kind of thing. And I would love to hear more from you around how you maybe use poetry as an expression of the body, how you use it to maybe channel some of your insights and what that process is like for you.
Heidi (28:51)
Mm, yay, great question. I love to read poetry out loud. It's the only way to do it. I am proud of the fact that in my little life, I have converted many people to be lovers of poetry just from slowly reading good poetry out loud. And
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (28:57)
Mm.
Heidi (29:13)
because when you read it out loud, you are listening to yourself and you are letting it reverberate in your body and the actual voice is already cellularly changing something in you. So when I think about poetry embodiment, 100,000 % because...
there's something that's moving through. The spirit is moving through, the love is moving through, the energy of awakening is moving through. So it's one of my favorite things. And you're catching me at this moment where I'm looking at my life and I'm like, you know what? If I had to choose one thing and only one thing that I could do or would do for the rest of my life, I think it would be to read poetry out loud.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (29:54)
Hmm.
Heidi (29:55)
I mean,
because I see how it affects people and I see how it quiets me. And I feel like I've been...
deeply loved after I read poetry out loud.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (30:11)
This is a more personal question, but I'm asking it because it's something I've experienced in my own life. It's just the very healing effects of poetry or a written word or spoken poetry as well. And I would love to hear from you if there are things that the practice or the art of speaking poetry or writing poetry has maybe healed inside of you or helped you hold that was hard in your heart.
Heidi (30:12)
Thank
Mm,
So what when I write poetry, I most often find myself showing up on the page when there is something hard and when there is something frozen. And I will say I have an we all do, but I'll just speak for myself. I have a very strong inner critic that
feels consistently behind or feels not enough or feels, I would even say sensually or sensorially frozen. Like there's a part of me that feels like I don't know how to receive or give.
pleasure. This is a voice in my head that I know is not true. so when I write poetry, I suddenly am like, here I am. Here I am under this beautiful tree. Here I am naming what has really frozen in me. And as I name it and as I massage it and as I love it, I set it free. So almost 80 % of my poetry
I laugh because I look at the beginning, which starts in a very tricky place, starts in a numb, starts in a angry, starts in a tearful place. But then I talk myself into the freedom and release. So then if I read that out loud, I get to create a new pathway in myself where I set myself free each time I read it out loud. And then eventually I'm like, wow.
I have done the work of that poem and I still love that poem and it will benefit others, but I'm not in the same place I was when I wrote that poem. So it's very embodied exercise for me.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (32:28)
Hmm.
I would love to hear more about if what you just described is a part of the work that you offer on your retreats when you kind of invite people also to embody their charts. But I'm curious if this piece kind of flows into that work as well.
Heidi (32:46)
100%. Yeah. One of my favorite exercises that we do at the beginning, right at the beginning, and it's a way for people to be with one another and meet one another is that I, I love, I collect poems, right? So I have hundreds and hundreds of poems printed up. And so I bring these printed poems and I splash them all over the room and people get into pairs and they read to one another as a gift. They read the poem. Like they, if I chose a poem and you chose a poem, we'd switch and I'd read you your poem as a gift.
So already the poetry starts to work as a gift that's been given to one another. And then every morning and the retreats and every time we gather in the circle, I read poetry. And what happened, I was just at Esalen in last, when was I there? Just like, at the very beginning of this year. And there was this miraculous moment where I started to read poetry and then one young woman just raised her hand and said, I wrote a poem this morning, can I read it?
And I was like, of course you can. She read it. Then all throughout the circle for an hour and 15 minutes, people just said, I have a song. I have a poem that I just wrote. Can I read these three lines? And so, and that's happened before at the Radiant Life Retreats as well in different ways where our own artistic expression sets another person in the circle free, you know, or inspires another person to be daring.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (34:05)
Are there particular astrology signs that we could tap into that would help us free up our artistic expression?
Heidi (34:12)
Yes.
I mean, look, when I'm, again, every single sign is creative. Every single sign has its own authentic expression. But I think one, I think as humanity, we are all walking the Leo Aquarius polarity because we're entering the age of Aquarius and the sign opposite Aquarius is Leo. And so in order for you to imagine what the Leo Aquarius polarity is about,
Imagine we're all in a circle. Imagine humanity is sitting in a circle. That's Aquarius. We're all looking at one another. We're all on the same level. We all respect one another as souls. And then imagine one by one, each person comes to the center and gives their gift. That's Leo. And so when you think about signs that help you liberate your full solar expression, think of Leo.
but also think of stepping back into the Aquarius circle, giving room for the next person to come forward. So you don't have to be a sun, moon, or rising in Leo. Everybody has every sign. You could have another planet in Leo. You could have something in the fifth house. The fifth house is the house of creative expression. So planets in that might help you express where your Mercury is. The planet of communication might help you express or write or share.
So if people are hungry to be creative, I'll often look, I'll look at the fifth house, I'll look at Venus. Venus is the planet of what we value in creativity. I'll look to the rising sign. I mean, there's so many inlets for it, you know?
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (35:46)
As we think about creativity right now, I would love to hear a little bit more from you around how one of your treats works. Because as you've named more and more pieces, I'm like, ooh, this looks really good, I wanna go. But I would love for you to just share with the listener what coming to a retreat with you really includes because what you're offering is such a beautiful blend of two things that I don't often hear go together.
Heidi (35:56)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, they are very, I started these retreats 15 years ago. They're called Radiant Life Retreats. The first retreat I had to beg, borrow and steal to get like four people there. you know, and I was like, soon I'm starting, I'm starting these retreats and I'll just do whatever I have to do to start these retreats. But now they have become a very Leo, Leo Aquarius experience, because as I said, over time, there's this incredible group of women have formed and
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (36:21)
Thank
Heidi (36:35)
they hold the circle for the entire time. So the fact is these retreats, the minute you step into it, there are always at least 15 returning women. And then let's just say there are another 10 to 15 new women, but always there are at least 15 returning women who say, come, welcome, welcome. And with full, true, authentic welcome, they're like, you're safe here.
We're gonna have a blast. We're gonna laugh our asses off. We're gonna cry. We're gonna feel better by the time we're done. So immediately you're welcomed into this circle where you feel like you can drop in very quickly and deeply and with a lot of trust. And one of the things that I do, you know, that was one of my great joys is that I start working with everybody that's gonna come. I start working internally with them about six weeks before and I make notebooks for everybody.
But I make collages. So each person receives a notebook that I have been working on, because I also love collage and I love images, that I've been working on, thinking about them, thinking about their charts for like six weeks. So immediately they also get this workbook that is filled with my just intuitive love for them. And so that's another entry point. And then throughout the retreat, we cover so much territory.
There are about six or seven women that offer different little pieces of it. We do the astrology of the moment. We do embodiments. Like if you were there, we would say, OK, Ailey, choose someone to play your sun, your moon, your rising sign. Let's see what it looks like if it's really dysfunctional. OK, now let's see what it looks like if it's fully evolved or on its way to being fully evolved. We do group embodiments.
There's always a sort of happening where these three wonderful women, Elizabeth, Meredith and Erin, they put on a kind of ritual ceremony performance art piece every Friday night that is like, leaves you either, just, they're profound, I'll put it that way. So, and then we have two amazing chefs that are like the top of the line chefs that just started coming to the retreat and then said, can we cook? And I'm like, yes, you can. So, I mean, in other words.
I'm just saying there's a lot of grace around it and poetry, writing, we do a lot of writing. It's in a beautiful place in Ojai. I mean, that gives you a little glimpse.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (38:57)
It does give me a little glimpse. And I would love to just hear if there is a reason why these, the type of space that you are creating for women, because that's what I've heard your population typically is, if there's a reason when we looked at collectively or astrologically in the collective, why these types of spaces are maybe so important for us to engage with at this specific time.
Heidi (39:21)
yeah, I mean I think partially it has to do, I mean what this has been, I was gonna say partially it has to do with this shift into Pluto and Aquarius, but of course I just feel like we need to gather, I'm gonna put it this way, okay, I'm gonna put it this way. We have been on solo journeys for a long time, like we were in the age of Pisces and,
In the age of Pisces, you're like walking along and you're like, I'm going to get to God, you know, and it could be a very solo pilgrimage, a very solo retreat where you, you might feel very solitary in the way that you see your spiritual life and your solitary studies. We are no longer in that time. The only way forward is together. The only way forward is to see ourselves in one another.
The only way forward is to say I, you know, my little daughter used to say, instead of I love you, she used to say, I you, I you, I you. And that's the only way forward. And so I try to gather people and from the moment they enter, acknowledge that we're like old friends. We're like souls who have found our way to one another again.
and that we are really IU. And this is the practice that has to occur if we're gonna survive, you know, and if we're gonna help one another up the mountain, so to speak.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (40:46)
I love that IU, it's so beautiful and so simple yet so deeply profound. Another piece that came to my mind as you were speaking, you named intuition as being a part of the retreat experience. And I would really love to hear about how, A, just how you perceive intuition, like what does that mean to you? And also the role of intuition in astrology, because there's so much information when you go
Heidi (40:49)
Yeah. Yeah.
Mm.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (41:13)
read astrology. And then there's kind of at least with the people I've worked with and in myself, and then there's kind of the intuitive like, yes, no, that happens or no, yes. And most of the people that I've seen in the astrology space are deeply intuitive. So if you could share a little bit of your wisdom on that area, I would love to hear.
Heidi (41:22)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah. I guess I'll say this. When I feel most intuitive,
there's something that's quieted down that is the chatter of the solve the problem mind or the chatter of the collect all the information mind. And there's something that bypasses that. And I would almost say,
moves from the heart to the soul, do you know where there's something there's a direct connection with the higher self. And I, know, the higher self, the true self, the soul self, there is a direct connection with the self that knows and observes us. And it bypasses the busyness of the problem solving mind. And
I think an intuitive moment can be a gift that's given to us from a greater collective, from a greater soul collective that's ours, that we get to receive in that moment. So it's something about, yeah, it's a receiving, it's a being ready to receive, it's a stillness that allows us to receive. And then as you said, like astrology is a huge part intuitive. You have to have all the facts, you have to...
rigorously learn all the pieces. And then you look at the person in front of you and you presence yourself. And I feel like I'm always just listening. How deeply can I listen? What is really being said? Because there's always something underneath what's being said. And so I listen for what's underneath what's being said. And
That's how I read charts is like, don't know where I'm gonna begin ever. I never start in the same place. But if you tell me how you are in this moment, it's my intuition that allows me to choose the planet with which I begin.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (43:28)
What are some misconceptions that people often have about astrology that maybe you've come into contact with? Because you did name like the rigorous facts and that's definitely something I've heard and experienced and witnessed in friends who've gone that path. And I know that that is a misconception that oftentimes that people just assume that there's just like the little clickbait that they found online and that there aren't like so many texts that outline and define things. But I'm curious if there are any other misconceptions that you come across.
Heidi (43:48)
Yeah.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (43:55)
or have come.
Heidi (43:56)
Yeah, I think people do not realize the depth and fullness of astrology. I could study astrology my entire life and not even begin to scratch the surface of what there is to know in terms of soul-centered astrology. But I would also just say another misconception, and I think there's a fear, though I think it's reducing, is the idea that if you go to an astrologer,
Some people come and they're very nervous. They're very scared because why? They feel like I'm going to tell them something that they have no choice around, which is never the case. Astrology is not fatalistic. It is not even predictive in the sense that I can't, I'm not gonna say this is going to happen to you because it's always this beautiful lens and tool for looking at the world and your own free will.
So I can certainly tell you the kinds of things that happen during certain transits and the kinds of ways certain signs express, but it's all about your level of evolution and how you meet the moment and how you choose to engage with these energies. And one beautiful thing about astrology is if you know something is going on, that's a huge life-changing opportunity, you can actually go and meet it instead of just sitting there.
You know, you can actually meet the moment. So if you have a book to write and you have a book to publish, you can use the astrology to sort of say, well, this is the moment that I should put it out into the world.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (45:22)
I apparently missed my moment. was a little slow with writing, but it's okay. That's what we're saying. I would love to know if you have any last pieces of wisdom on astrology and how we can use our chart before we leave the listener today.
Heidi (45:25)
Ha!
Look, take 10 years sometimes, you know what I mean?
just say very simply, if you do not know your sun, moon and rising sign, most of us only know our sun sign, if you do not know your rising sign or your moon, you're missing out. And for that matter, if you don't know your Venus placement or your Mars placement. we do something with, I have a team of astrologers that are so wonderful and we do something called an astrological snapshot where if you don't know a lot about astrology, you can just
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (45:57)
Thank
Heidi (46:10)
order a little audio that one of the astrologers makes about your sun, moon and rising and you start to get a much fuller picture. People feel so relieved when they learn about their rising sign because they're suddenly like, oh my gosh, you mean it's not just this? It's this and this is actually what I'm here for. This is what I'm actually here to cultivate. I mean, it's extraordinarily beautiful. if, and you know, I, you, we all need encouragement right now. We all need
to feel like it's all gonna be okay. And we need to feel like until, you know, what can we do in this time of uncertainty? And astrology is one of the greatest gifts instructing us what we can do in this time when everything feels wobbly and out of sorts. How can we continue to become more fully who we are?
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (46:57)
Thank you for reminding us that astrology is a form of encouragement, but also an embodiment of love. It was really lovely to spend time with you. We will have all of your information where people can find you, your books, the other people that work for you or work with you, where people can get the astrological snapshot. Is there anything that you have coming up that wouldn't be online, but you know is coming out that maybe you would like the listener to know about?
Heidi (47:23)
Yes, I would just plant this seed because right now I'm actually taking my first kind of respite in a while. The next retreat will be in October in Ojai. And you can keep your eye open for that. But I would just plant the seed that every month we have a community called Luminosity Community and it's on Mighty Networks. And every month there are about seven classes by different astrologers. And I also do a poetry hour.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (47:34)
Mm-hmm.
Heidi (47:49)
every month where I just read you poetry and it's just 24 bucks a month so it's so reasonable and it's if you need community right now if you need friendship camaraderie community this is a very sweet way to gather several times a month if you if you would like so that while I'm kind of taking a little respite that continues and and then the next retreat will be in October.
Ailey Jolie (she/her) (48:12)
Thank you so much for your time today.
Heidi (48:14)
Thank you, Ailey. What a joy.